Wrestling With Roleplay

[Luncha_Libre]

Hey, folks! So, I wanted to start a thread to talk about the idea of wrestling, and how we role play it. I know everyone here has a different enjoyment of professional wrestling, be it the stuff we see on U.S. television, or international indies or what have you. Also, I know some of us enjoy it purely for kinky purposes, while some of us watch pro matches and soak it all in, while trying to figure out how we can apply that to our role play.

So, I wanted to start a thread where folks could discuss their love of wrestling, vs their love of role play. Is there anything that you see in wrestling that you have a hard time replicating in roleplay? LAW matches are meant to be straight competitive vs. kayfabe, how does that affect your character decisions? Do you have any questions about why something makes sense in the context of wrestling, while it makes no sense at all in a legitimate combat sport?

Just to get the ball rolling, here's my one pet peeve, in trying to sell a move: the Irish whip. I get why it's important, and I love that it sets up great moves and I have no problems with having my characters fall victim to it over, and over again. However, if anyone has any advice as to ways to mix up selling it, I am all ears! Hope you folks have some ideas on these things, too

[anime_hentaifighter]

Interesting idea for a thread. Think we get some good discussing out of your idea luncha

[xalex]

how to sell it? you mean how you sell the pulling or the impact with a object? The wrestlers keeprunning because they would be facing away from their opponent if they would stop running and that would be the worst possibility. When you watch wrestling like a fight imagen that when you have your opponent behind you he got the upper hand. WHen you run away from after the irish whip you try to creat some seperation to avoide a follow up.
hope i could help

[Fairy Dragon]

lol...your pet peeve is a bit ironic considering what I just posted.

Anyway seeing it as an actual Combat sport (As in its treated like an actual thing as opposed to it just being something you do your best to sell as a legit thing) I generally try to have my characters privy to the fact that while they may be here for various reasons its a competition and they should strive to be the best at it. Course how they go about being the best can vary, for Kyoko for example she thinks winning and defending belts she makes important or holding any belt in general defines greatness. Where people like grace or Kerstin would agree to holding official belts but are just as concerned with proving themselves and making wrestling a healthy environment. Some like Miranda feel like being the best is getting peoples attentions which is why shes very showy, she wants people to come back and see her and she doesnt necessarily think a title guarantees buy rates. An Interesting look and Gimmick do

Thats also how I see some Gimmicks. Some are just because the person is legit quirky like that but for characters like Amy they do there whole Lion Schtick cause it helps them stand out so there not just "Big girl no. 20" and gives them something to define them by. Kyoko feels the same though part of her gimmick is the fact that she is just that oddly quirky, Amy doesnt legit think shes a Lion when she goes into her gimmick XD.

Though I guess things I have a hard time replicating in role play is how to get some kind of heat, as we know in wrestling heat is defined by the crowd reactions unfortunately as we also probably know crowds react to various things differently and while we can always just say how the crowds supposed to react thats a bit different from saying something that would legit piss a crowd off, I try to do so to establish how a character is but I'm always nagged by the question if I'm doing it right. Which kind leads into a pet peeve of mine, someone taking control of the crowd to decide how they would react to something someone else in a thread did. Its happened to me a few times where I'm trying to set the crowd one way and then my partner has people react to it another way, if crowd work is part of the story were telling in a thread it might be good to get a general idea of the direction were going before a thread stars rather then people having differing ideas on how they'd react and just saying there way is correct.

[CaptainL]

It's come up on the Discord recently, but I do feel like one big aspect of wrestling that roleplay can't really capture is the commentary. Great commentary can really make a difference in a match - would Undertaker vs. Mankind be the same without JR? - and there's a lot of things that could potentially be done with it, like using how commentators react to the wrestlers to establish someone as a threat or communicate their personality or how they're received by others. However, you can't really have a memorable commentary team without personalities, which would mean someone would have to make the commentators as characters, and then they would have to just post in the threads recapping what we've already seen. The best idea I've seen put forth is to include a note in a post about how the commentators would comment on so and so, but I don't know if that would really create anything that would add much without establishing just who the commentators would be. Yes, I'm aware that someone made expies of JR and Lawler in the staff section a long time ago, but I'm not too keen on that myself. They were a fantastic team, but I'd rather have something new with an identity all its own instead of ripping off an existing formula. I guess one way would be to decide on a set of communally-owned characters that anyone could write the reactions of from time to time, but then that could also just lead to chaos if someone decides they want to develop them in a certain direction, or if they said something that contradicted what another user did with them.

Another thing that I think is kind of lost in the roleplay format is the faster pace of some segments, where the wrestlers are trading blows in rapid succession or doing things while their opponent is setting up something at the same time. Faster action can really work for the flow of a match and get the action hyped up, but in a roleplay you kind of have to go at a slower pace. It's hard to do anything faster without controlling the other user's character, especially if you're someone like me, who likes to make sure each post recaps the action of the last, gives the character's reactions to it, and details what's going on in their mind at the time, all before you even get to what they're going to do next!

[Luncha_Libre]

Interesting replies, so far! Thanks, folks!

how to sell it? you mean how you sell the pulling or the impact with a object? The wrestlers keeprunning because they would be facing away from their opponent if they would stop running and that would be the worst possibility. When you watch wrestling like a fight imagen that when you have your opponent behind you he got the upper hand. WHen you run away from after the irish whip you try to creat some seperation to avoide a follow up.
hope i could help

The selling I'm referring to, is my character running out of control. Your suggestion makes sense, and is an interesting way to look at the psychology of rolling with an Irish whip. I suppose the thing I always struggle with is the physics of it, but again, I don't actually mind the Irish whip as a move. And I love the interesting stuff that it sets up. Your suggestion gives me another angle to think of 'selling' it from, so thanks for that!

lol...your pet peeve is a bit ironic considering what I just posted.

Anyway seeing it as an actual Combat sport (As in its treated like an actual thing as opposed to it just being something you do your best to sell as a legit thing) I generally try to have my characters privy to the fact that while they may be here for various reasons its a competition and they should strive to be the best at it. Course how they go about being the best can vary, for Kyoko for example she thinks winning and defending belts she makes important or holding any belt in general defines greatness. Where people like grace or Kerstin would agree to holding official belts but are just as concerned with proving themselves and making wrestling a healthy environment. Some like Miranda feel like being the best is getting peoples attentions which is why shes very showy, she wants people to come back and see her and she doesnt necessarily think a title guarantees buy rates. An Interesting look and Gimmick do

Thats also how I see some Gimmicks. Some are just because the person is legit quirky like that but for characters like Amy they do there whole Lion Schtick cause it helps them stand out so there not just "Big girl no. 20" and gives them something to define them by. Kyoko feels the same though part of her gimmick is the fact that she is just that oddly quirky, Amy doesnt legit think shes a Lion when she goes into her gimmick XD.

Though I guess things I have a hard time replicating in role play is how to get some kind of heat, as we know in wrestling heat is defined by the crowd reactions unfortunately as we also probably know crowds react to various things differently and while we can always just say how the crowds supposed to react thats a bit different from saying something that would legit piss a crowd off, I try to do so to establish how a character is but I'm always nagged by the question if I'm doing it right. Which kind leads into a pet peeve of mine, someone taking control of the crowd to decide how they would react to something someone else in a thread did. Its happened to me a few times where I'm trying to set the crowd one way and then my partner has people react to it another way, if crowd work is part of the story were telling in a thread it might be good to get a general idea of the direction were going before a thread stars rather then people having differing ideas on how they'd react and just saying there way is correct.

LoL, the timing of that is funny! Again, tho, I promise that I don't mind Irish whips in matches, I just struggle with writing to them. Loved your post, by the way- really enjoying that thread thus far

As for crowd heat, I totally get what you're talking about. I tend to dictate crowd reaction based on what I think a standard crowd reaction would be (or what I would want it to be, based on the character I'm trying to roleplay). That question of "doing it right" is a nagging one tho, isn't it? I'm not sure there is a purely objective way to do that- I mean, I've seen sequences by wrestlers IRL that seemed like gold, but got nothing out of a dead crowd.

I see where your pet peeve would be a tough thing to deal with. Other than coordinating with the other player (or trying to read carefully for things like crowd tone, to see what they're going for), I'm not sure the best way to consider crowd reaction. Fan reaction is such an important part of how characters are built in wrestling, it does seem pretty important, too.

It's come up on the Discord recently, but I do feel like one big aspect of wrestling that roleplay can't really capture is the commentary. Great commentary can really make a difference in a match - would Undertaker vs. Mankind be the same without JR? - and there's a lot of things that could potentially be done with it, like using how commentators react to the wrestlers to establish someone as a threat or communicate their personality or how they're received by others. However, you can't really have a memorable commentary team without personalities, which would mean someone would have to make the commentators as characters, and then they would have to just post in the threads recapping what we've already seen. The best idea I've seen put forth is to include a note in a post about how the commentators would comment on so and so, but I don't know if that would really create anything that would add much without establishing just who the commentators would be. Yes, I'm aware that someone made expies of JR and Lawler in the staff section a long time ago, but I'm not too keen on that myself. They were a fantastic team, but I'd rather have something new with an identity all its own instead of ripping off an existing formula. I guess one way would be to decide on a set of communally-owned characters that anyone could write the reactions of from time to time, but then that could also just lead to chaos if someone decides they want to develop them in a certain direction, or if they said something that contradicted what another user did with them.

Another thing that I think is kind of lost in the roleplay format is the faster pace of some segments, where the wrestlers are trading blows in rapid succession or doing things while their opponent is setting up something at the same time. Faster action can really work for the flow of a match and get the action hyped up, but in a roleplay you kind of have to go at a slower pace. It's hard to do anything faster without controlling the other user's character, especially if you're someone like me, who likes to make sure each post recaps the action of the last, gives the character's reactions to it, and details what's going on in their mind at the time, all before you even get to what they're going to do next!

That's a really interesting idea, too! I guess in my threads, I try to insert the kind of comments I would want commentators to make into my text. I guess since in my head, a good commentary team should be enhancing the story the performers are telling in the ring. But I guess that's a bit of artistic license unique to the RP, isn't it? I like your idea of someone doing a commentator/recap thread, though that does seem like a lot of work on the part of whoever would do it. Also, I totally agree with your thoughts on having a unique sort of commentary team. I had a character on another board to 'guest commentary' on a thread, but that was part of an ongoing story and it was very one-sided. Might be a fun idea to revisit, though it would be tough to keep on top of without holding up someone's thread. Still, interesting to think about!

[JollyRoger]

I would like to add momentum to the list of things you have when you go along in the Irish whip as it is a double edged sword because it enables countering with high impact and a high chance of success. It basically changes the pace of a match.

Then there are certain moves that lack impact by nature because a small guy moves a bigger guy(hurricanrana) or are so long telegraphed that you think it should never hit an experienced fighter(discus clothesline, bicycle kick) which can be executed much better if your opponent has momentum and also has some time to spend until your move hits.

Then there is also the kayfabe aspect. As we all know, heels suddenly forget how to wrestle flashy in the WWE so it is used to make the face build up his routine after a super boring two minute resthold.

The move I personally struggle with is the bear hug. If your arms are not also caught in the hug, I don´t see how anyone can fall for it, but if they are the move does not make much sense. The easiest way to free yourself is a poke in the eyes or a double slap on the ears, the largest majority of people will quickly let go if your eyes are threatened or their sense of direction is not working properly. And yes, your concentration will be on the crushing move around your waist, but safety is so close that you need only a spare movement to end your pain.

I don´t need commentary very much. I grew up with commentating in my native tongue and always found for example Jerry Lawler tiresome at the commentary, even at his best times. I like the commentary of style Booker T though, which many people hate

Kayfabe in RL is dead, which really hurts wrestling in my opinion. In an ideal world, wrestlers would not post their latest barbecue where Alexa Bliss cuddles with Becky Lynch or something. In roleplay kayfabe is not dead, at least that is what I like to pretend, and I write accordingly.

In RPs, I like to write more kinky stuff because writing a really kick-ass pro wrestling match that really grabs my attention is possible but very hard to pull off.

[Vc0m]

Per the Irish Whip thing, personally, I just try to sell that the rebound is to close the distance quickly and try to attack the opponent, not fully knowing what the person Irish Whipping the other has planned.

A weird pet peeve of my recently have been holds and hold counters. I've been watching a ton of British Wrestling in recent months, and seeing a ton of chain grappling from people is really awesome, especially since I am trying to sell GASTER as hold heavy...

...problem being I don't know too many holds outside of what I see on NXT UK or NXT or the like (and no combat sports whatsoever) so that leads me to not fully knowing how to counter specific holds outside of a rope break. I figure something out occasionally, and I did manage to have a very counter heavy thread with Winner recently...but I dunno. It's been bugging me lol

[Taskmaster12]

I would like to add momentum to the list of things you have when you go along in the Irish whip as it is a double edged sword because it enables countering with high impact and a high chance of success. It basically changes the pace of a match.

Then there are certain moves that lack impact by nature because a small guy moves a bigger guy(hurricanrana) or are so long telegraphed that you think it should never hit an experienced fighter(discus clothesline, bicycle kick) which can be executed much better if your opponent has momentum and also has some time to spend until your move hits.

Then there is also the kayfabe aspect. As we all know, heels suddenly forget how to wrestle flashy in the WWE so it is used to make the face build up his routine after a super boring two minute resthold.

The move I personally struggle with is the bear hug. If your arms are not also caught in the hug, I don´t see how anyone can fall for it, but if they are the move does not make much sense. The easiest way to free yourself is a poke in the eyes or a double slap on the ears, the largest majority of people will quickly let go if your eyes are threatened or their sense of direction is not working properly. And yes, your concentration will be on the crushing move around your waist, but safety is so close that you need only a spare movement to end your pain.

I don´t need commentary very much. I grew up with commentating in my native tongue and always found for example Jerry Lawler tiresome at the commentary, even at his best times. I like the commentary of style Booker T though, which many people hate

Kayfabe in RL is dead, which really hurts wrestling in my opinion. In an ideal world, wrestlers would not post their latest barbecue where Alexa Bliss cuddles with Becky Lynch or something. In roleplay kayfabe is not dead, at least that is what I like to pretend, and I write accordingly.

In RPs, I like to write more kinky stuff because writing a really kick-ass pro wrestling match that really grabs my attention is possible but very hard to pull off.

I don’t think it’s more Heels ‘forget’ as it is they don't want too. Considering heels are generally focused on winning they lack the care to grandstand and impress fans for the most part. M

Anyway while I sometimes suck at it my main idea when it comes to wrestling role play is the role play, trying to tell a story was something I did on other sites (not wrestling related) and while I’ve always loved wrestling I feel mostly comfortable in stuff like that more then I do wrestling matches weird as that sounds given the circumstances XD. Though I can confidently say I feel like I’m improving on that end and I do want to get better at the wrestling aspect of this since that’s just as crucial if not more then the story stuff. As far as kayfabe goes I always say it less like a thing that exists in this world and more just a kind of guideline of how to let yourself be seen. Take MMA for example some of those people like Chael Sonnen is one of the biggest shit talkers when it came to fights but are a bit more humble about it away from the environment and he’s not alone in this regard , there not playing a character in the same sense as a wrestler would but they are trying to make themselves stand out or look larger then life which is how I feel a lot of my characters are, playing caricatures of themselves to garner an interest either through being very aggressive or very boisterous (which is probably why the closest thing I have to a face on my roster is a borderline tweener XD)

[Satoshi]

I'll be honest here, I came here for the lewdness primarily, not so much the realistic (or unrealistic) pro wrestling. (Never quite watched pro wrestling really) However, after some time, I started getting a ton of fun just out of writing my characters. Right now especially Yuuki and Elise come to mind, where just writing their perspective and the way they behave and act has been just so much fun even in non-lewd threads. Of course, that's not to say I dislike my other characters.

Per the Irish Whip thing, personally, I just try to sell that the rebound is to close the distance quickly and try to attack the opponent, not fully knowing what the person Irish Whipping the other has planned.

A weird pet peeve of my recently have been holds and hold counters. I've been watching a ton of British Wrestling in recent months, and seeing a ton of chain grappling from people is really awesome, especially since I am trying to sell GASTER as hold heavy...

...problem being I don't know too many holds outside of what I see on NXT UK or NXT or the like (and no combat sports whatsoever) so that leads me to not fully knowing how to counter specific holds outside of a rope break. I figure something out occasionally, and I did manage to have a very counter heavy thread with Winner recently...but I dunno. It's been bugging me lol

I completely get the problem of not knowing enough moves, in my case not just grappling but similarly in strikes/aerials or pretty much anything due to my lack of pro wrestling knowledge. Especially as for Yuuki for example I know want to give her a good aerial repertoire but I simply don't know moves she could use. That I feel like is the biggest problem with my rp, since due to not knowing too many moves or wrestling strategies I'm often at a loss for what my girls could do in a situation if they were to attack, without repeating myself too much.